- cross-posted to:
- politics
- cross-posted to:
- politics
You must log in or register to comment.
Plan would be simple. Resign from the Presidency for health and personal reasons. This would immediately promote Harris to the Presidency, who could inherit the campaign cash and pledged delegates, and begin to sharply campaign on continuing the Biden legacy and attacking Trump with every skill at her disposal.
Wouldn’t be perfect, but it’d avoid a big, chaotic, inter-party fight with no prep time, and would preserve the sense of incumbency. Harris could even pick an actual progressive as her running mate, maybe a Katie Porter, and help shore up some support on that flank as she fights for the moderates.
Not a great nor necessary plan.
- If Biden resigns as president, yes Harris immediately becomes president. That means that Speaker of the House Mike Johnson is only one heartbeat from the presidency until January 20.
There’s no way for Harris to appoint and get confirmed a replacement vice president, and it would be impossible anyway because replacing the vacant VP slot requires a majority of both the House and Senate.
- It doesn’t when work for becoming the new nominee. Becoming President due to a vacancy has exactly nothing to do with becoming the nominee for the election for president.
Becoming President in this case is by the Constitution. It’s the law, it’s how our government works.
Becoming the nominee is internal political party, legally private non-governmental business.
What does work, whether or not one wants Harris as the new nominee, is this:
Biden drops out as the Democratic nominee for President, while remaining in office as President saying he must put all his energy and attention into governing these remaining months.
Then,
IF the party wants Harris. Harris aggressively campaigns to be President ELSE
Harris states she has to put all her energy and attention into helping Biden govern so will not accept a nomination.Open convention occurs, but likely with a lot of prior discussion and alignment towards one or two best candidate.
Face saving all around
That means that Speaker of the House Mike Johnson is only one heartbeat from the presidency until January 20.
That happens if Biden slips and falls in the bath tube, too. Its not an argument for keeping him at the top of the ticket.
That happens if Biden slips and falls in the bath tube, too. Its not an argument for keeping him at the top of the ticket.
No that is not what happens. I’m not arguing to keep him at the top of the ticket. Exactly the opposite: I’m arguing to drop him from the not yet official ticket, but for him to stay on as president until his term ends. That keeps Johnson still only second-in-line for the presidency, with Harris still first-in-line.
If Biden (referring to his governmental role as the current President) dies, Vice President Kamala Harris immediately becomes President.
Whereas referring to his nongovernmental role once (IF) he becomes the official nominee of the Democratic Party, nobody is automatically elevated to be the new nominee of the party. If it’s before the election, the executive board of the DNC determines the new nominee. Harris would very likely become the official nominee, but that’s not their only choice.
But Biden is not yet the official nominee no matter how many times he and his supporters say he is. He is only the presumptive nominee. So if he died, was incapacitated, or dropped out as a candidate for the nomination now, before the convention roll call, it becomes essentially an open convention and the nominee is chosen the way it used to be, by the convention. Which might take multiple roll calls, behind the scenes favors trading, and all sorts of “fun” drama.
In none of those cases is Speaker of the House Johnson elevated to anything.
Dems control the Senate. For the House, would just need a couple repubs to flip. Otherwise it would have to be left vacant I suppose. Mike Johnson being next in line does not worry me.
Correct, Harris would not automatically become the dem nominee. However, assuming Biden’s chosen delegates are loyal to him, I think it’s reasonable to guess they would honor his chosen successor and voluntarily vote according to his wishes.
A convention is a possibility, and I’m not completely against it. It complicates matters severely though, and not for very significant gain since citizens can’t really vote again in such a short timeframe.
A couple of Republicans flipping to replace a Republican VP? That would absolutely never happen. Ever. This is less likely than the Sun rising in the West.
Yeah, you’re probably right. Leave it vacant then.
If any Republican being president doesn’t worry you you aren’t paying attention.
Most people really don’t like Harris though. Keeping Biden is the better option at this point… The Dems have just royally fucked everyone by playing this “emperor’s new clothes” game with Bidens dementia.
Yeah, she’s far from perfect. But, it’s better than a big, chaotic, unprecedented free-for-all. Everyone was expecting 4 more years of this administration anyway.
Closed conventions weren’t the worst. I’m honestly fine if the DNC were to just pick someone at the convention after backroom conversations. Def too late for there to be any sort of election. I’m personally hoping Gretchen Whitmer somehow gets the nomination
Yeah, I don’t want them to do it that way normally, and I think a mini-primary could generate hype, but this is a unique situation and I can tolerate them doing it not-right to try to respond to a disaster. My expectations for a replacement are very low.
Tbh, I think that Harris is a big ol nothingburger of a candidate. Fox news got conservatives to hate her easy enough for the crime of being a [black, woman] Democrat, but that doesn’t mean anything to independents. Harris is disappointing to more libertarian minded and further left folks (like me) because she was kind of a stupidly aggressive DA, but I don’t think that really bothers independents either. Harris herself had a middling debate performance in 2020, but still managed to beat the pants off Biden, who appeared DOA on the 2020 primary stage. She’s never espoused any especially strong policy positions that I know of, either, besides being another authoritarian centrist.
All of this kind of wraps up into a very boring, plain vanilla candidate, which could well work to the democrats’ advantage in this election cycle. Here’s my opinion: Harris has several key advantages over Biden.
-
People are tired of feeling like we’re on a cursed timeline, a normal candidate without obvious sundowner’s or a serious case of fascism would likely be welcomed. Harris is about as average as they come, imo.
-
She can actually talk. Let’s face it, the Biden of 2020 and 2012 is mostly gone, he can’t communicate like he used to, and pretending otherwise isn’t helping. Harris was a DA in her past life. Lawyers, and especially DAs, have to be able to communicate effectively. My guess is that if you put a little polish on her, an absolute bull of a speaker/debater will shine through. It’s just that the democrats haven’t really given her a chance to shine. That or the possibility that same as they’ve been hiding Biden’s condition, they’re hiding that Harris is a truly wretched communicator who has wound up here through a comedy of errors, but I’m relying on Occam’s Razor here.
-
The one time she stood out at all in the primary debates was when she put Biden on absolute blast for his record with regard to the black community. It wasn’t smooth, it was obviously rehearsed, but it still landed a haymaker. It’s not a stretch to think she could do the same to Trump.
-
Being a nothing candidate could actually be advantageous because, I mean, how do you attack that? She has almost no real baggage compared to Biden or Trump, and it wouldn’t be hard for her to just set up a smorgasbord of different policy choices without sounding like a hypocrite or flip flop.
I really wish the democrats had had the foresight to prepare for this moment by picking a much better VP, or having an open and honest primary, but we’re here now and there’s nothing we can do about the past. Imo, Harris is the best chance we’ve got of keeping the fascists out for the next four years.
Yeah, I wouldn’t vote for Harris in a primary, but there’s nothing egregiously wrong with her. My biggest complaints in the primary were her prosecutor-history and her unreliable policy positions. I don’t even think she’s a centrist, I think she doesn’t really have much in the way of policy at all. A blank slate willing to tack to the center if the progressive lane is full, or tack to the left if that’s where the energy is. And the law and order history is basically no worse than Biden and kind of useful when one of Trump’s big issues is all his court cases.
I wish we had a primary, I wish Biden hadn’t effectively chosen the next nominee, and I wish that, if that was the intention, he would have put some effort into building her up rather than dumping shit jobs on her, but if we need to do an emergency replacement, she’s fine.
Play up her former DA status. This year the election is between Law and Lawlessness.
Harris: “I would be happy to prosecute the case against the felon in the next debate, let’s just see if he shows up for his court date or if he’s too busy taking bribes from his rich tech bro friends.”
-
Most people don’t like Biden. More than don’t like Harris. There was some early idea that Harris was uniquely disliked that people keep propagating for some reason. She’s not a superstar, she lost the primary for a reason, but she’s not some especially toxic politician. At least not for anyone who would say “keeping Biden is better”.
She’s a former prosecutor, she’s not the best communicator, she isn’t particularly charismatic, and she doesn’t have a history of generating good legislation.
I’ll take it, she will still have that incumbent power and name recognition.
There are still a lot of people who might vote for Biden, but wouldn’t vote for a woman, especially a non white one.
If we get a chance, big if there, we will only get one.
Eh, we need to stop pretending like the only gettable votes are closet Republican racists. There are a lot more Democrats than Republicans, and Trump has turned off even more. Obama won twice and Clinton still beat Trump by millions of votes, and Clinton had a whole host of other issues more relevant than her gender. Non-white and women candidates are viable. Yeah, every vote is valuable, but Biden’s been losing basic Democratic groups that Harris (or really any replacement) can reconnect with and juice turnout.
Yep, the Democratic problem is not persuading cultists on the other side, it’s energizing the base.
Her voice is annoying. That sounds super stupid and superficial, but that’s enough to ruin the gut feeling of the average voter.
Yes, I’m sure you think you’re a great proxy for the average American voter. Too shrill maybe? Maybe too much vocal fry? Or maybe some other vocal feature that only applies to women?
Trump’s got the stupidest fucking voice there is and dumb vocal mannerisms to boot. Biden whispers half his press briefings. Her voice is fine. It’s a normal woman’s voice.
And stuff like this is why we’ll lose.
Someone gave a specific thing they didn’t like and it was immediately dismissed as misogyny and the person was told “her voice is fine” like that’s going to change anyones mind.
LOL, fuck off. The specific thing was “her voice was annoying” which both isn’t a real complaint and is a common complaint of women in general. And it’s being applied to a woman who has a really normal voice. Dude deserves to be dressed down and Democrats lose when they duck and cover to try to accommodate vague fears about how everyone but them is actually unshakably sexist/racist/homophobic, so just run a straight white dude again.
If Biden could prove the debate was a one off he would have done so. His continued lack luster perform after the debate shows what the road to November looks like with him. Dems lose. Because most people who would vote blue will do so anyway. It’s the 1 in 100 on the margins that will decide this thing. If Biden nominee = Trump 2nd presidency = all of the terror that comes with it, then who gives a flying fuck if Kamala right now polls even with Biden.
What, you don’t think that he was actually thinking real hard about beating Putin?
I’ve counted and I can guarantee there are at least two dozen Americans that aren’t Harris or Biden.
We can shore Biden up with a good Neuralink for the short term. Offload more and more functions to ChatGPT, but trained on someone articulate like Snoop Dogg.
With Biden’s political experience and Snoop’s ability to complete a sentence, we could keep this administration going. Let him google stuff too, in real time. Then he’s got an excuse for zoning out.
I will point out that Biden dropped out shortly after this epic burn
Most people really don’t like Biden either.
I could see a video getting leaked of Jill Biden slapping Joe around saying he ruined her life cause of the debate
Not my fave plan but it’ll do. Shit, I’m voting D no matter what. I will always vote against the republican traitor filth.
Not my fave plan but it’ll do. Shit, I’m voting R no matter what. I will always vote against the democrat traitor filth.
Cool, I’m glad this bothered you. You cunts deserve no respite.
That point just flew right over your head huh?
No, I caught on to you thinking yourself clever when you’re just a standard issue dumbass. Kindly fuck off.
The poor guy’s fence post is damaging his brain.
Ok, you have fun in your cult while judging the people in the other cult
Who would be Harris’ VP pick?
She’d probably pick a straight white guy to try to defuse some bigotry concerns, but in my fantasies she picks Katie Porter.
My dream vote goes to Pete B. Though I’d guess they save him for a Presidential run.
Wall Street Pete is always there when corporate needs a railroad accident covered up!
Pete has dropped his ice cream in every race he’s been in. He’s snakebit for some reason that I can’t reckon, and I’m not sure it’d be wise to run him unless he can really show that he’s figured out a secret sauce to get people engaged. Not a bad vp pick, though.
Isn’t he gay?
Let’s be real here, that should not matter, but it does to a lot of people.
That whole “yes I want to take your guns bit” is a really bad look.
Yeah. I want to pretend that wouldn’t matter. =/
That could be more an advantage with those on the left than it is a detriment for the bigots on the right or the middle. It is a valid point, though.
He’s a pretty amazing off-the-cuff orator, however. He’s be great in a VP debate.
Regrettably he is far too smart and not politically savvy.
Yeah, he’s a policy nerd. I like policy nerds, and I’m mostly happy with the job he’s done in the FDOT, but policy nerds don’t tend to fare well in our elections.
🤞Bernie Sanders 🤞
Can’t we find someone under 80?
Probably but who would fire the left up more than Bernie?
AOC, but that won’t happen.
She can’t beat Trump.
I don’t think we need someone popular to beat Trump. Just someone that can run a strong campaign.
Trumps fans may love him, but he is not himself a broadly popular figure in any other circles.
Trump is not a good candidate, everyone the dems run is just horrible
So lie to voters more and say it is for health and personal reasons when he’s been saying he’s fine this whole time? What a final FU that’s be and what a way to energize your base with another big lie. He should admit that he was wrong and has decided to step aside cause he thinks it’s best for the voters and best for the party and best for the country. PERIOD. Nothing else needs to be said.
I don’t think voters would blame a politician for trying to portray strength in their campaign. Sensible ones anyway.
I think there is a difference between messaging and denial. I feel like the Biden campaign often goes so far overboard when presenting the positives that it comes across as dismissive and tone deaf. Kind of like how it’s frustrating when someone in a debate doesn’t actually answer the question but instead just pivots to talk about whatever.
Yeah, there’s been a lot of team Biden messaging that’s reminded me of HRC16 messaging, and that’s been giving me the willies. Hillary and her campaign came off as hugely tone deaf, and ultimately relied on just bashing people with “just shut up and vote or we’ll get Hitler”, and that’s kinda what the Biden messaging has been lately as well. It’s not a happy thing to see resemblances in.
Once again, it offered a sharp contrast with former President Donald Trump, who, even after his brush with death on Saturday, will appear at a raucous coronation at the Republican National Convention in Milwaukee on Thursday night.
Lick boots harder, you complicit oligarch fucks.
It’s fucking gross. It has never been more clear than the past few weeks just how much these media corporations mold the narrative into what they believe will lead to the most engagement, consequences be damned. After all, what’s the US government gonna do, fine then $10,000? Oh no.
One poor debate performance, and thanks to the feedback loop of the media, half the country is ready to give up the incumbent advantage and replace him at the last minute with someone who has no name recognition. Meanwhile, the other guy is not only incapable of forming a full, coherent statement without a teleprompter, he’s literally told us he plans to be a dictator.
Kyle Gass gets black listed for a joke about the attempt. Meanwhile, we have companies selling life-sized decals of Biden hog-tied to put on your F-350.
And now they’re complicit in this whole “Trump is calling for unity” bullshit, and reporting that he has nothing to do with Project 2025 as if there was any truth to that whatsoever.
The Trump campaign is doing everything they can to distance themselves from their own stated policy goals because they know how unpopular those goals are. And the media is reporting it as fact.
I’m so sick of the double standard. These people have been spewing violent, racist, homophobic, transphobic, genocidal rhetoric for over a decade.
But someone on the left makes a harmless joke and the media dog piles despite it being absurd. But gotta get that engagement at any cost.
What the actual fuck is that quote. Deer lord.
All hail the deer lord!
fuck man. did they leave him up this long just so we automatically vote for whoever they put up next out of sheer desperation
That definitely sounds like exactly the kind of guaranteed-to-backfire strategy the Democratic part loves!
Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory is a time-honored Democrat tradition.
They want to do a sequel to the 2016 election it seems like.
Left him there to take a few billion dollars of attack ads his replacement can ignore.
Yes
Biden world? I want off Mr bidens wild ride.
Worst theme park ever
deleted by creator
I really hope Harris can beat Trump.
As much as I hate it, I think there too much subconscious misogyny to try it. It’s a recipe for failure.
And racism. Can’t forget the racism!
Well as a European, I’m going to give the US some credit: voters did elect a black, ‘possibly-Muslim’ guy with a name that sounds vaguely like a well-known terrorist. And they elected him twice.
Besides, the democrats really appear to be in a situation where they’ll vote for a proverbial ham sandwich if it stops Trump from getting the presidency.
Are there racist voters who hate women? Obviously. But it’s not like it’s an immediate disqualification.
Make it a real ham sandwich instead of a proverbial one, and you’ve got a deal.
The ham sandwich has my vote since its not Trump.
I think that would work for her. There’s way more minorities and centrists that would come out to vote for her because of Obama’s legacy than racists that would stay home out of spite IMO. I certainly don’t think she’ll be anything like Obama, but one could hope.
Though racism is a factor, that doesn’t mean she isn’t also a bad candidate.
Aren’t all of the misogynists already voting for Trump? I think just being a younger woman candidate could energize the younger voting base.
I’m afraid a lot of older Dems just wouldn’t vote, it’s a low turnout that could be killer.
I don’t know if she really resonated with the younger voters that much, not like AOC for instance.
Especially with bodily autonomy being a live issue
Yeah it will energize, and they’ll be really confused on voting day when they find out they needed to register to vote.
I think voting should be mandatory, easier, and have an abstain option for those people who don’t want to choose.
All the right wingers who wanted Trump are going to vote for him and all the Republicans that wanted someone else rallied behind a woman during their primaries. I think people are blowing up an issue thats less impactful than they make it out to be.
I’m sure there’s plenty of misogyny and racism to put people off, but don’t underestimate “being another bland candidate who won’t get people excited enough to vote”.
It wasn’t just women haters that made Trump beat Clinton.
People’s lives are shit, and while Trump will for sure make them even shittier, “things will be mostly the same as they are now, with some baby steps towards things you’ve wanted for decades” isn’t exactly a rallying cry for the ages.
The Democrats were never going to let Sanders have anything, but AOC? Maybe? She at least makes the news when she says things. And unlike Republicans, they’re not horrible things.
Probably not, she’s got the charisma of Hillary, and two strikes (race and gender) against her. But Biden is dragging the rest of the party down with him. With Harris we probably get a Trump presidency (we have at least a fighting chance to avoid it). But with Biden we get a Trump presidency, a landslide election giving him a “mandate” and assuredly a Republican House and Senate to go along with it. Sooo worth a shot with the old switcharoo I guess.
She can’t.
Whitmer maybe could. If she has a strong running mate.
Harris just isnt a good candidate.
Oh no you don’t. We’ve got Whitmer until the end of 2026. You can have her then and not a second sooner.
If SCOTUS keeps on this retro “states rights” bender, we’re just gonna make our own country. With blackjack. And great lakes.
The only thing Whitmer is good at is destroying state economies, and killing small businesses.
I think she can if she chooses a progressive vp
Possible, but Unlikely. 🙁
Yeah…I feel no matter what we are not in a good place to defeat Trump. I’m just trying to think of best ways given what we are given. My choice would be biden and replace Harris with a progressive woman
I feel no matter what we are not in a good place to defeat Trump.
I don’t think that’s actually true. I think the polling data we have is skewed against Biden, and models like The Keys to the White House (which don’t reference polling data) point towards a Trump defeat. 538 has Biden beating Trump more than half of the time, and it’s even using the polls. Things aren’t nearly as bad as people are making them out to be, and I don’t know why.
If it’s on NBC, it’s likely to happen this weekend.
Yeah there’s no going back from talk like this.
Anyone’s allowed to talk, and media companies talk about whatever people will click on.
I think it happens today and it makes the weekend not be about the republican convention.
Probably right. Strategically, it makes the most sense… But the DNC lacks that attribute.
Please, not another octigenarian
Totally agree. There’s no reason we can’t find someone a little older even still.
Jimmy Carter is still alive.
Exhuming Dianne Feinstein and putting her on the ticket.
There is Bernie and Nancy and they are both fired up :D
Is part of the reason for a big drop off in “big donor money” because of Biden’s (sudden) age?
Or are the wealthy just accepting that Trump will make them way wealthier than they already are at the trivial cost of democracy that would only affect the poors anyhow?
Seems like democracy in America is already snuffed out and the wealthy rats are happily trying to get the last good spots on the dictator-ship
deleted by creator
I’m holding out hope for Mark Kelly
DNC Komissars can’t even name the replacement so this is Kamala driven campaign?
It’s a trap so the GQP can force ballot shenanigans
Yeah, the GOP made Biden old and confused, lol
Oh wow, is this a totally new thing? Is Biden just suddenly old or was he always going to be this age when fucking time moved on. But hey doesn’t seem to stop Trump
This whole thing is so fucking stupid. If the Democrats wanted a legitimate candidate they should have thought of that way before but instead they fucked it up. Now by trying to replace Biden. They’re going to fuck it up even more. But hey he’s old I mean come on better let the fascists win
Did you just thaw out…? It’s absolutely a new thing! Watch Biden from during debates and speeches just a few years ago. Or even the Vice-Presidential debates from 2016. That was only 8 years ago, that’s barely even a thing for an 81 year-old!
doesn’t seem to stop Trump
Trump lied like crazy before, during, and after the debate. But at least he was present and himself, he didn’t freeze, he didn’t have a vacant stare, and didn’t literally snatch defeat from the jaws of victory by getting confused and mentioning his opponent’s strongest issue on an unrelated question to him! Age affects everyone differently. And I have to mention, this wasn’t just a one-off: Biden also had cognitive performance issues during press conferences, speeches, and UN addresses post-debate. This isn’t some GOP plot, we all are witnessing it with our own eyes!
If the Democrats wanted a legitimate candidate they should have thought of that way before
I really, really hate this argument. Biden’s symptoms hadn’t progressed to this point yet and the DNC manipulated things to make sure he had no “real” rival for the 2024 nomination. This decline happened suddenly and unexpectedly. Anyone caring for an elderly parent/family member understands. Moving on…
he’s old I mean come on better let the fascists win
I get that we have different opinions, but let’s at least be honest. We all want to avoid another Trump presidency, that’s why people are voicing their opinions, and this is literally the only time to do it! Once he’s locked in as the Nominee, we’re stuck with him. Like Democratic leadership, former presidents, major donors, and the public, I think someone else still has a better chance beating Trump and avoiding Project 2025. Now is the only time to explore other options as we contemplate the best way to avoid the end of democracy in the USA…
