If lemmy.world finds this, please tell my starving children that I love them.
But have you thought about the shareholders and the executives? They are the ones that really have it bad!
If only those lazy poor people worked harder and pulled themselves up by this bootstraps.
It’s not like we systemically work towards keeping them poor so we can have the power!
Last quarter my 401k dropped by 0.3%! IM THE VICTIM HERE
To be fair when you have that much money 0.3% is a lot of money (for a poor person)
they still have so much they wouldn’t miss it if there wasn’t a number on his balance telling him he lost money.
imagine how much 0.3% of some billionaire asshole’s money could help rebuild people’s lives.
My response was sarcastic, but also accurate, and yes that tiny bit could do a whole lot of good
It’s more that the 401k grew 0.3% the previous. Still growing, still a lot, just not quite as much of an increase.
We can’t let the elites got taxed too hard. What if I finally win a lottery and join the elites? My wealth would be sucked dry by the excessive tax!
deleted by creator
I’m in my 40s and I honestly still don’t understand the appeal of the GOP to the average American. I have never seen them put forth a policy that does not seem to be shitting on one group or another. What has the GOP done in the last 40 years to make the average citizens life better?
shitting on one group or another
That’s the whole point. They’re the party of oppression, and the people that follow that party believe that those groups should be oppressed.
That’s the interesting thing they don’t. They typically do the best they can to make lives worse for their constituents and they’ll be happy about it as long as the “others” are getting fucked over more than they are.
I don’t think it even has to be “more” so long as others as being fucked over that’s good enough for them
That they hate some of all the other people the consevative voters hate, and they are happy to starve if the group they hate starve too.
It is a stupid premise I know, but you can see posts about evil things the gop does, and somehow “centrists” find a way to blame the democrats for that.
I think that is actually true. The average poor republican doesn’t want to be wealthy, if that would mean that would also become more wealthy or have more rights. This also applies to other political subjects. I mean a poor republican who works a terribly paying job with no worker rights or healthcare would actively vote against politicians who say they’d want to change that situation, just to make sure that underage girls that got raped are forced to give birth to their unwanted childs they then can’t provide for.
It is sad, but I also agreed with that.
Not sure why they are like that but as long as the ones they hate also suffer the conservatives are ok.
But they never stop to see an alternative where anyone has to suffer.
Its partly like that but its MORE so that they are utterly convinced that all thier troubles including that they are poor is some other groups fault, and even when they do have doubts they are unable to express them without fear of losing thier status in thier in-group. So they will keep on voting against thier own interests and blaming the wrong people for the results.
That is also true.
Literally an echo chamber
You’re not far left enough for me if you’re still thinking that instead of “let’s go grab the guillotine”
The replies to this are insane. These people are actively harming millions. Its their fault if the world forms a fist aimed at their faces.
That’s fine with me, I don’t have any interest in “let’s just kill a bunch of people” as an ideology. It’s objectively wrong.
That’s not the ideology though, guillotine memes are essentially just pushing for revolutionary restructuring of the state and economy. Nobody simply thinks “kill rich” and stops thinking there.
Nobody simply thinks “kill rich” and stops thinking there.
That’s news to me, I always got the impression that “???” Was the next step after “kill rich”
More accurately, revolutionary restructuring of society is the first step towards a better future.
If we boiled down any political ideology we could probably say they are all about, “let’s just kill a bunch of people.”
At least with revolution the barrel is pointed at the oppressor not the oppressed.
No, you couldn’t. That largely goes against The ideology of actual libertarians, anarchists, and communists.
With the barrel of revolution, the oppressed are targeted frequently. Revolution is brutal, indiscriminate. And most importantly, temporary.
If I wanted to be a dick I could.
Which is the exact mindset that has us in arms against billionaires.
So could anyone. But what does that have to do with anything?
Your edit isn’t making anything any clearer. I’m all for eliminating millionaires and billionaires. In the sense of eliminating the concept. Not the people.
It’s exactly how this conversation started. Revolution isn’t about indiscriminate killing.
I’m all for restructuring of the state and economy. But when has revolution ever truly worked long term. Has it worked long-term in France? Definitely in the short-term it made some change. Did it work long term in Russia? North Korea, etc. Replacing one inflexible authority with another is only asking to repeat their mistakes.
When the argument for an ideology as it has for so many of them, boils down to “you will accept it under penalty of death”. It might be that it’s a bad ideology.
I’m with Marx, it should be an evolution. Not revolution. Leftists giggling over guillotine posting isn’t helpful. Because it was an all too real thing, for good or bad. Realistically it makes more enemies than it could ever remove.
Billionaires aren’t people
Believe it or not, they are. Only humans are capable of such cruelty.
This is silly. Billionaires are people, otherwise guillotines wouldn’t be effective.
Right, a society of machines would never create something as vile, insidious and wasteful as a billionaire
In this case it would be self-defense. The only reason anyone thinks otherwise is because the danger posed by a billionaire money hoarder is far more abstract than what most people are accustomed to.
The guillotines aren’t necessary if the rich would strive for a better society.
The thing is that they would never agree to that, so then we need the guillotine.
The path to a better society is elimination of Capitalism, so Capitalists aren’t really going to agree to that, no matter how nice it would make things.
I don’t think people should die but I do think people have a right to steal if that’s what will keep them alive. am I not far left enough
I’m actually surprised by people who think others should just die instead of stealing, if that’s the choice. Who wouldn’t steal?
Guess we won’t know since those people are dead.
It appears symbolism isn’t a trait you possess.
Far left in my country would be terrorist organizations from the leftover decades where terrorist groups formed around the Soviet communist idea.
This argument is basically the same as those put forward by the right wing nut jobs that think their second amendment rights to tote a rifle will let them fight against the US govt.
Just because a method functioned a couple centuries ago in a far simpler time, does not mean it will function today. Gotta keep up with the times there gramps.
Did it? Friendly reminder to all that the French Revolution was a failure.
Are you operating under the impression that the French Revolution created the current republic? If so, you’re missing many, many steps. One of which was a fellow named Napoleon who crowned himself emperor.
I’m… agreeing with you…
Ah, was not sarcasm. My mistake.
The important part is to direct the anger towards the real enemy: the leeches sucking our planet dry and planning their escape off world. „Left“ and „Right“ are categories we were told to think in, along with buzzwords like „neoliberal“ and „woke“.
As in the definition of a cult, special language is used to divide us further and cut us off from one another.
Even calling for guillotines is kind of the same thing. We should stop killing each other. Just seize everything they have and leave them fending for themselves, same as every one of us.
The idea that Capitalists are directly controlling the media and intentionally inflammatory to create endless culture war that divides the Proletariat against itself is a firmly leftist belief.
I mean, it’s also objectively true, but “leftist” and “true” align more often than not.
Leftists generally are correct and also morally superior to conservatives, yes. Conservativism is reactionary and opposes liberation, in favor of maintaining current power structures, even if it relies on outward hatred of the less fortunate.
Although it is understandable that you are frustrated with the „others“, I think the „right wing nutjobs“ are not what conservatism actually aspires to be.
If you read up on conservative values, the ideas are partly morally sound:
- limited government
- rule of law
- fiscal responsibility
- human dignity
Those were the only ones I could find that are most probably agreeable. I agree that fascists are evil but if we put everyone in that basket who wants to take care of their homeland we’re no better than them. We should know better.
Or did I not understand you correctly?
In my opinion, the actions of conservative people and politicians are inconsistent with their stated values.
I agree. Thats why I said it. Conservatism isnt the enemy. People are riled up against each other and ultimately themselves.
There’s a difference between espoused values and practical plans. Conservatives want strong government, draconian punishment to keep people in line, limited social safety nets, and traditional gender roles and family structure. All of this is built on regressive outlook and results from reactionary outlook.
That is what current „conservative“ politicians in certain countries do. What I‘m saying is that we‘re only hurting ourselves if we hate each other. Instead we must agree on things and keep each other honest imo.
One reason why conservatives turn to right wing nutjobs is because someone (populists) promises them answers they can understand. The evidently more educated side instead looks down on them. Its obvious from the derogatory language some people use.
I‘m saying we wont make this world better by killing each other. The enemy is in control of the media and tries to cut off education (paywall it, dilute it) so we‘re easier to manipulate.
I know. I‘m just trying to get peeps from hating each other because this only helps those in power.
From the downvotes I deduce that not everyone likes the idea.
As in the definition of a cult, special language is used to divide us further and cut us off from one another.
Which definition of a cult is that? Because there is no scientific definition. There are models for high-control organizations (a term used specifically because “cult” has too much baggage for scientific methods), and language is only one aspect of information control. Every single organization on Earth will create its own language for things. That alone doesn’t mean they’re high-control.
I’ve been in a high-control organization. It doesn’t work like that, and I think diluting the term to cover such broad categories is insulting to people who have been there.
Saying something shares the mechanics of a cult is not insulting to someone who has been in a cult if that is what you mean.
Its a pattern I recognized. People fight over who is right and left, neo-contra-whatever. Its ultimately not informative and makes misunderstandings more common.
And what I‘m actually saying is that the media is controlled by the same people who benefit from us fighting instead of demanding housing prices go down immediately or wages go up accordingly. Its not that hard. We‘re just told its impossible.
If you don’t let people starve. They’ll learn to be lazy and it’ll be the downfall of our society! /s
we should also get rid of the inheritance tax so I can make sure even more generations of my family will never need to work and be lazy! /s
Yes we need the society to look like Hercule Poirot’s England where you had to wait for your uncle to die, or help them on the way, to get some inheritance.
When I feed the poor, they call me a saint, but when I ask why the poor are hungry, they call me a communist. - Hélder Câmara, an archbishop
Hélder Câmara ❤️
Júlio Lancellotti ❤️
Câmara identified himself as a socialist and not as a Marxist, and while disagreeing with , had Marxist sympathies. In the Fallaci interview, he stated, “My socialism is special, it’s a socialism that respects the human person and goes back to the Gospels. My socialism is justice.” He said, concerning Marx, that while he disagreed with his conclusions, he agreed with his analysis of the capitalist society.
The people whining are literally brain damaged. Conservatism is legitimately brain damage. Given the harm they do though I have no sympathy.
That study states that brain damage can cause more conservative views, but the reverse isn’t true. Not everyone with conservative views has brain damage.
arguable
Idk I live in the south with lead pipes And lead has shown to cause brain damage And conservatives are the last to car about lead pipes
Hell my house sewage is just being pumped under the street cause our streets water main is broken
Yet the city claims it’s our responsibility to pay someone to dig up the street and fix it
We fixed our pipes to the main but we can’t afford to do all of that
What are you saying, you want the government to just bring you clean water? Like, without sewage? Like through some sort of taxpayer funded infrastructure? Fucking commie.
Tomato tomato.
You’ve got cause and effect backwards my man
Both can be true. Like a communicable disease, someone can have it and someone else can get infected and then also have it.
That is a very interesting research area.
This is kind of an aside but it’s always weird looking at caricatures of poverty from the 90s and earlier, where people live in modest homes they seem to own. Or people living alone in plain apartments in places like New York.
A six-figure salary in so many cities means that you can probably rent a decent apartment and never own anything. It’s just so obvious that this system isn’t working.
If there’s one thing Hollywood is known for it’s accurate depictions of the housing market.
You’re right, but on the other hand, no one in the 1980s watched Married With Children and thought, “a shoe salesman? With a house? How absurd!” Because houses were affordable.
housing used to be affordable. I’ve seen the value of the modest house i grew up in increase in value after my parents sold it so much that I can’t afford to even think about buying it now that i’m the age they were when they bought it. and it looks like the new owners have let it go to shit.
Exactly. People did talk about how homes on TV in the 1980s were unreasonably large, but the idea that Al Bundy’s family or Roseanne’s family couldn’t have a house at all was not even one people considered. Because of course you could afford a house.
Also, you could afford a house at this time with only one person working in the couple. The wife usually stayed at home until they progressively all went to work.
Commie. The poor will just trade the food for drugs, might as well throw it away as trash and shoot anyone that gets near it.
Walmart is that you?!?!
Source: I used to work at Walmart and they threw away so much stuff and locked it in a dumpster with constant surveillance
I’ve always wondered where i would land on the political spectrum if I didn’t live in the US
Do you think the Means of Production should be owned collectively, or individually? Do you agree with horizontal power structures being dominant, or do you believe more in centralization?
There’s a ton more to it, but those 2 questions pretty clearly give you a direction.
Choosing the first options is communism, right?
Collective ownership of the Means of Production is Socialism, generally. Communism is the specific Stateless, Classless, Moneyless society built on the foundations of Collective Ownership along Marxian analysis, but you can have Collective ownership in, say, Syndicalism, Anarchism, Market Socialism, Democratic Socialism, etc.
as somewhat of a ‘commie’ yea kinda, but again its crazy that someone who toils away at work for the better part of his life and earns a salary for his contribution to society will sometimes have to be hungry or homeless. on average you do all that and are at least always struggling for money come on.
considering we have smartphones, rockets and AI, at this point im surprised some people are not considering alternatives.
Pretty sure the general attitude toward .world is that the users tend to be liberals, especially those who came from Reddit during the API fiasco. Generally people who mean well but probably haven’t engaged with the Linux, FOSS, Privacy, Anarchist, Socialist, or Communist communities before coming to Lemmy.
.ml itself is generally more leftist, a common misconception is that there are only Marxist-Leninists on .ml, when there are tons of Anarchists and Socialists as well, just much fewer liberals.
Where Hexbear is a big-tent “dirt bag left” server, and lemmygrad is an explicitly Marxist-Leninist-Maoist server, .ml is actually just focused on FOSS and privacy, and as such tends to attract more leftists than .world.
An example of the differences between .world and .ml I have noticed are on the recent death sentence for the KyoAni mass murderer posts. On the .world version, most seemed celebratory of the death sentence, while on .ml most were deeply saddened by the event but held the belief that the death penalty is wrong fundamentally, and that instead it should’ve been life in prison.
Just my 2 cents as a .ml user.
Removed by mod
Pragmatism and nuance are for bigots and fascists, vote third party
[edit] /s, christ-a-mighty
Removed by mod
Tax should pay for healthcare of all citizens.
Why am I paying tax if I still have to pay to see a doctor?
deleted by creator
I really wouldn’t mind the whole rhetoric of pulling yourself by the bootstraps if it wasn’t rigged. The system is literally made to make ppl fail.
There’s also the fact that it originated as an expression meaning “doing something impossible” since pulling on your own bootstraps would PREVENT you from getting up.
Sounds very american to me. Its very normal here to at least try take care of the less fortunate.
Well, so long as they’re not migrants anyway
One of the defining traits of the left is empathy.
One of the defining traits of humanity is empathy.
If you’re not left you’re less than. I said it. I stand by it.Dehumanization of the other
Woaaaah there buddy
I appreciate you
Humans are really good at empathizing. But we are also really good at delineating between in and out groups. It was crucial to protect your tribe over every other human. We now have a massive problem of entire countries or even the world being the “in-group” since we have enough resources for everyone to survive.
But those people wanting power are really good at exploiting that group mentality to cause groups to form in people’s minds. Then they use that delineation to withdrawn empathy from those new out groups. And when those delineations aren’t coherent among actual groups, it causes a lot of divisions that can be exploited.
The average poor Republican would starve to make sure a “Welfare Queen” or “Tweeker” didn’t get a free meal.
deleted by creator
Empathy-like behavior and brain activity has been observed in many animals. Make it less than those as well
