- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
As this project appears to be fairly unknown in the fediverse still, I’d like to use this opportunity to advertise Flohmarkt. This Fediverse equivalent of Facebook Marketplace already has some instances up and running - see here: https://codeberg.org/flohmarkt/flohmarkt/wiki/flohmarkt-instances
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What about Craigslist
This looks cool! Any android apps?
I am super curious how does it stack against DAC7 European Directive 2021/514 from 22 march 2021.
The European law says that such sites must provide a list of users and sales
In my local area government interrogates selling boards about my data what I sell and such. I wonder if this could be forever resistant to authorities provided somebody actually uses it?
as always with these, it really comes down to whos using it.
God… remember how fucking simple craigslist was when it hit it’s peak? The fact that Grandpa could take a shaky flip phone picture and post a thing you needed right around the corner, no fat or other frivolous horseshit…
Craigslist is still simple last I checked, but the user base left and now dominated by spam from retail and drop shippers masquerading as local people selling goods from their garage.
Nothing gold can stay
At least when I used Craigslist, there was no social network element to it, so it was difficult to determine the trustworthiness of any given poster.
For that reason, I don’t want a Fediverse clone of Craigslist – I want an existing Fediverse platform to add a marketplace. I will not use anonymous marketplaces.
If you feel any kind of meaningful trustworthiness from a Facebook profile, you’ve probably got some other things to worry about…
I don’t agree? Even in big cities, I’ve often seen marketplace posts from people with mutual friends, so I could easily verify their trustworthiness. In other scenarios I can at least check to see if their posting history and/or profile seems legit or if there are any red flags. Having more data helps people decide whether to trust someone, but Craigslist doesn’t allow for that.
Idk. It’s still got some uses. My dad got a bunch of industrial refrigerator panels for stupid cheap off Craigslist like 6 months ago.
Yeah, you can still get something from the odd crank, but used to be much more practically useful for day to day needs.
Will keep an eye on this, but there is nothing too local here (No, I can’t host something myself). Given how the specification says there should be a location and radius per instance, some admins are really slacking on putting that info in the description.
How do I tell someone on the bus to check out this website?
I just took a list at some instances and was confused. Is there not a location-specific aspect? When I selected “Local” I got nothing. The only use I had for FB marketplace was buying/selling things locally. Like as a craigslist replacement. Not seeing that on these sites, unfortunately.
The idea would be to host local instances.
Maybe the local instances can report up to an index.
The name has already made this nonviable for the average person
Does it? If you set up an instance for your local community/city/whatever, and name it something that makes sense for your intended userbase, I think it would be fine.
It goes from “I sold my couch on FlohMarkt” to “I sold my couch on Local Ottawa Marketplace” for the ‘normies’ out there. They’re not going to care about the underlying software so long as their couch gets sold.
Do recommend a DIY local advertising strategy if trying to get something like this running, though - posters at IRL flea markets, adverts in small community papers for antiques and collectibles, crossposts/links to postings on stuff like MaxSold/Kijiji/Craigslist/GumTree/FB Marketplace/[insert online marketplace operating in your area] by first adopters, that kind of thing.
Focus on the current primary use case of centralized marketplace services (buying shit from your neighbours), then introduce the “Oh yeah, we’ve also set it up so you can see postings on Local Toronto Marketplace, Local Kingston Marketplace, Marché Local de Montréal” etc. from there.
I really, really think talking to people in terms of specific instances over the overarching platform/protocol is a way around ‘normie’ confusion about the Fediverse when first trying it, then getting exposure to how it works in practice will help them understand the nitty gritty stuff better. Is this problematic in some cases, like with Lemmy? A little bit, yeah. For something like FlohMarkt? I think less so.
(‘normie’ in quotes 'cause I’m not the biggest fan of the term, but it’s a useful shorthand)
Uber.
it’s not that it’s German (or whatever), it’s that it looks and feels like it’s gibberish. it’s incredible how little this is understood.
Uber is an easily read, easily pronounced, widely understood, positive sounding trochee. it’s a perfect brand name.
flohmarkt is 0 for 5.
Even Floh is a bit better 😕 .
It’s not that bad. It’s just German for flea market. And English speakers shouldn’t have an issue with at least “Markt”. Not far from a cognate.
Definitely better names but I think the bigger hurdle is getting the critical mass to get something like marketplace to work in the fediverse even with the perfect name.
german looks notoriously complicated for people who dont speak it
The sentence structure is kinda wonky coming from English, but the vocab isn’t bad. There are tons of cognates.
what some people don’t get is that “flea market” is also a bad name. floh just makes it look and sound worse and it’s harder to parse let alone understand and therefore remember.
Yep. It’s kind of annoying when people see everything through an “english” lense and assume anything that isn’t made to work for english speakers won’t work…
Op has a point. Even English names that succeed internationally are somewhat bound by the ability of speakers of other languages to spell and pronounce the name. Y’all are here acting like what they’re saying is hateful or something…
Its even more important to use various word from various language.
English as default also resulting American culture as the most prominent culture.
Newer generation are more acceptable to outside culture, so this will be work. Not to forget, the rest of non-English society already operate in multi language society and get exposed for various culture.
Years ago, people heavily localized Angliscize a lot of Asian media, but now, people are more accepting foreign naming convention. Just take a look at various FOSS porject in Japanese, Hindi, Persia, or Finnish.
No one is saying you cannot have a good German name. Uber is an American company. Shit company but great name. Comes from German and translates to other linguistic communities fairly well
Uber isn’t a German word tho?
Etymology From German über (“above”, preposition), which is also used as a prefix (über-); cognate with over. Entered English through Nietzsche’s use of the word Übermensch. Doublet of over, super and hyper.
Something, something über alles…
But telling a friend about this starts with the name. Simple names are easier. And that would just start with making it short. Single syllable being best.
Isn’t this more like the software you’d use to build whatever local (but maybe federated) site? Like, you don’t ask your friend if they’ve been on Shopify or Squarespace lately.
Yeah, possibly. Depends – if the data is federated between instances (which I assumed) you could have access to the whole world’s market and it would still be useful if there was a feature that allowed you filter out locations you’re not currently interested in.
Yeah, would also be nice to be able to combine multiple local markets.
Like eBay, Facebook, Twitter, Amazon?
We have to stop sending end users to software solutions for web admins. We don’t send them yo “nginx” or “apache”, after all.
Someone throw up a website using this software and give the site a sensible name, and then direct users to that website.
Flohcebook Marktplace
Fleabuch Maktplatz
Fleabook
Flohcebook mohktplohce
SPEAK ENGLISH ÖR DIE
Germans speak or not as ör out. When you us imitate want, then make it pleasly right!
Sabbel ma nich so vonner seit döspaddel
I have myself apparently mistaken, I please about apology. In future will I try, no generalized sentence about Germans to do.
Germans don’t have sentences, they have long words.
Oh look, the Queen of Naming has spoken! Everything should just be named “Facebook something” or “Twitter that”.
iMarket is better? gStore? 銷 !
“gStore” sounds… suspicious. XD
I can’t understand why every other fediverse name is so stupid as to be off putting to the average user.
- Lemmy is no better or worse than Reddit
- Pixelfeed is significantly better than Instagram
- Mastodon is much worse than Twitter
Seems to me pretty much an even spread of how good the names are
I tried to use it myself and it really isn’t ready yet. It’s missing so many features that a specialized Lemmy instance seems like a much better alternative.
Maybe share your vision with the devs or actively contribute yourself to the development of this platform? :)
Great idea. I just wonder how Flohmarkt is read by non-Germans. Anyone want to state their opinion, their initial experience seeing the word, on that?
It honestly just looks like a spelling mistake to me
Indonesian here.
Indonesian have highest trilingual population in the world, and our country regularly import foreign pop media, like from Japan, China, Turkiye, French, Argentine, and so on.
That name seems cool and we will never have problem with it.
In fact, a lot of FOSS software in Asia almost always use local language or pop culture reference for their project. Whether it’s in Chinese, Persian, Hindi, Javanese, Japanese, and so on.
Non-German but I am in the EU. Didn’t find it odd at all. Just assumed it was “flow market” in German.
Close. It’s flea market.
Swede here, see no issue with the name. I’ll just ignore the h when pronouncing though.
That’s what you should do anyway, the h simply elongates the o
My American brain wants to read it as “FlowMart”, or “Flowmark”. Neither of which I have a problem with.
Which is also reasonably close to the German pronunciation (which is something like Flo-marked to an English speaker)
I think an English localization as ‘Flowmarkt’ or ‘Flowmarket’ might be more catchy in English-speaking countries, since the intended pronunciation for ‘Flohmarkt’ isn’t clear at a first glance.
Why would English be objectively better than German?
Because more people speak it?
Chinese says hi.
Please stop these idiotic arguments. I don’t think you’re actually so dumb, that you don’t understand what my point was. So you’re being willfully obtuse just to annoy other people. Also, Chinese isn’t a thing. You probably mean Mandarin Chinese, which does have the highest number of native speakers. But English is still the common language (or lingua franca) across the world, even though it is number 3 in terms of native speakers.
Still doesn’t mean everything has to be named in English, or with whatever naming idioms marketing people and shareholders like. Have some variety in life. Go touch grass.
This is about localization, not about renaming the thing
Got it, let’s name it in mandarin then
Language Native Speakers Total Speakers Sources English ~380 million ~1.5 billion Wikipedia German ~76–95 million ~155–220 million Wikipedia Mandarin ~941 million–1.12 billion ~1.1–1.3 billion Wikipedia Well, it has 10x more speakers than German, but it still has fewer speakers than English and most of them are localised in a single country.
Please stop being an obnoxious ass. English is the de-facto lingua franca of the world, acting like German is in any way comparable is just disingenuous.
I love that you called it the lingua franca.
Why yes, English is the French.
Uh do you not know what “lingua franca” means or are you making a joke?
I didn’t say it was. An important aspect of promoting the adoption of any product or service is having a brand name that is easily pronounceable to facilitate word-of-mouth promotion. It’s something that’s all the more important for a Fediverse service, given the lack of means to promote Flohmarkt with paid advertising campaigns.
While Flohmarkt works as a brand name in German, it’s not immediately clear how to pronounce it in English, versus the easily pronounced Lemmy, Mastodon, Misskey, Pixelfed, Loops, and Friendica. For that reason, ‘Flohmarkt’ should be kept as the platform’s name in German-speaking countries, but be localized as ‘Flowmarkt’ or ‘Flowmarket’ in English-speaking ones.
Do you think Flohmarkt is worse than Volkswagen?
Yes, since the pronunciation of Volkswagen can be inferred from taking ‘Volks’ as rhyming with ‘Folks’ and either pronouncing ‘wagen’ as intended—with ‘gen’ rhyming with the ‘gain’ in ‘again’—or just pronouncing it as ‘wagon’. In contrast, the pronunciation of ‘kt’ at the end of ‘flohmarkt’ can’t be inferred from an existing English word. Additionally, using the spelling ‘flow’ disambiguates the English pronunciation of ‘floh’, especially when dialect is taken into account.
Ultimately, because Volkswagen has had decades of advertisements marketing its proper pronunciation and making the brand name widely-recognized, it has an inherent advantage in terms of brand recognition to start with.
“flow market”
Initial impressions of the name are not great.
I forgot its spelling the moment i scrolled past it.
just read it as ‘flow market,’ realized it was german, and looked up the word. it doesn’t look weird at first glance.
I read it as being pronounced something like “flow-marked”
yeah, it’s quite close
At least most speakers of European languages will pronounce it close enough to German - though most will not do make the r in markt as hard as Germans do.
though most will not do make the r in markt as hard as Germans do.
Most German dialects (including standard German) barely pronounce that r. It is noticeable, but far from a “hard” pronunciation, in that case i is more like prolonging the “a” sound.
Yeah but if you had to search for it you’d have a trouble spelling it. Flowmarked would be how English speakers would hear that I think.
It probably needs an English brand name for outside the germano-sphere - fedimarket?
And why should we name things for the exclusive convenience of monolingual English speakers to the detriment of everyone else?
I don’t disagree conceptually, but English has been a lingua franca for a long time now.
That’s not an issue for brands. German and Chinese brands are just doing fine everywhere with the possible exception of the two countries in the world where people are not exposed to other languages.
Definitely weird on first reading. New names often seem weird or dumb at first so maybe I’ll just get used to it. Anglicizing it might make sense? Fleamarkt?
It reads like regurgitating dehydrated phlegm
Edit:
Anyone want to state their opinion?
Germans: “Das is der inkorrect opinion Herr Irlandisch”
That name…
They need to use an easier name, like Kleinanzeigen or something
Not enough umlauts to count as easy.
Sprich deutsch!
Du
Nachkömmling
Interesting idea. How do you deal with illegal trade?
Maybe just like Facebook Market, simply ignore it? /s
This is what i need so i can finally delete facebook but unfortunately this is too early and small with nothing piblically uk based and no one looking at it so things would never sell.
