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Agree. But it’s not kids, it’s stupid people of all ages. Same thing happened with Reddit and with the Internet as a whole. Used to be you had to be a little smart to know you wanted to be on the Internet and figure out how to get it working. Then same was true of forums and IRC. Then same was true of Reddit. But then Reddit changed formats trying to be a TikTok style quick content scroll app, so idiots who just want to scroll started using the site and quality of discussions went down. I hope Lemmy grows but I hope the sign up process stays as it is, to weed out the extra stupid.
I think you‘re onto something. I read a lot of comments of people thinking the fediverse is too complicated to deal with and while I disagree - but also think it has issues - there does seem to be a barrier of entry for a good portion of people in the form of „inconvenience.“ So whoever is here really wants to be here and not just be an anonymous arse. I don‘t think you gotta be particularly smart, you gotta step out of your comfort zone.
Hmm this is also a good point. I’ve been explaining to redditors that Lemmy is not that complicated and only takes a couple minutes to get started. But reading this, now I’m hoping Lemmy can find the balance between number of active users and quality of content. I’m wondering if my spreading the word on reddit was a bad idea.
Maybe the “work” required to make the jump to Lemmy will be enough to keep lower quality content (for whatever reason) at bay for a bit longer, though. Of course, it won’t last forever. All we can do is make our communities good spaces from the get-go and try to maintain them carefully as we grow.
I think the way Lemmy works (wrt federations) makes this less of an issue. Eventually people who like the way things used to be will primarily use oldhead instances that only federate with other oldhead instances. Lemmy.world will end up feeling just like Reddit (more or less) but there will always be spaces for other communities.
I think it‘s good to grow. Lemmy (or the Fediverse, I suppose?) should be as inclusive, convenient, and engaging as can be. It has only just started (in my opinion), we‘ll see how it goes. I like it here so far, feels like people are less prone to jump at your throat for voicing a (harmless) opinion.
Which part of it is supposed to be complicated? I’ve seen this argument many times, and while I’m still trying to figure out the user interface(s), the whole idea is pretty basic
Yes, this exactly. I’m starting to suspect that either someone very misinformed or someone with an agenda started spreading this rumor.
It just takes one person to reaffirm that it really is “too much work to switch” and “you aren’t lazy for not trying” to keep a lot of folks in place.
This kept me off Lemmy until the blackout. I was interested prior to that, but so many people said it was complicated, I figured I’d look into it at some vague point in the future when I had time to untangle the fediverse. Then the baclout happened, and what do you know I had time, and lo and behold it was easy. I’m now a bit annoyed I was dissuaded for so long based on BS about it being complicated.
I just had to find an instance (or “site”) that allowed sign-ups and register. My first account was on Kbin since it seemed less buggy on mobile. I feel like they think something’s complicated just because it’s on a website, or because there are multiple options.
It’s not rocket science but if we’re being honest about it, it’s not exactly an easy concept either. Going from centralised to decentralised for a social network is not an easy idea especially when one isn’t familiar with federation.
For example, at first I was confused because I’d browse a community on lemmy.ml, I’d want to hit subscribe, but then my account is on lemmy.world.
The fact that the website “moves” while I’m reading a post, doesn’t help either.
I had to get a better grip with defederation too. So, on one instance you see 4 comments, but another instance has 5. Because one of the instances doesn’t federate (at least that’s how I understand it now). Or maybe it’s just lag?
Anyway what I’m getting at is I understand why people say it’s complicated and I for one wouldn’t have bothered to get familiar with these concepts if reddit wasn’t going kaboom.
I can‘t tell you since I also disagree. I did basically the same thing I did on Reddit, I only got thrown off seeing multiple „subs“ with the same name.
Some people complained how complicated „explanations“ are. I saw these types of comments on the Reddit Alternatives sub.
Getting one’s head around the concept of instances is hard for some people who aren’t used to dealing with tech beyond the basic social platforms.
Is it one social media platform, or is it a bunch of individual ones? The fact that the answer is “it depends” is confusing. Especially when you get into defederation and cross-platform interaction.
Very true. I often make the mistake of thinking that if something makes sense to me pretty quickly, it will be just as quick for others.
We should remember that those of us here now are more likely to be uniquely interested in this tech and thus more able to wrap our heads around these concepts without being deterred. We could always do a better job making it accessible for beginners who don’t benefit from the same background.
I’m also a bit confused by it being ‘complex’. I created an account (I chose .world as it had world in the name, as it turned out that was a great decision lol), you log in, click on ‘all’ and sort by top/day you’ve essentially got ‘Reddit’, or am I missing something lol.
It was the worst thing to witness on reddit. A post with tens of thousands of likes and only a handfull of comments
I boosted from 1k karma to 20k by searching ‘pun’ on every top joke each day for a week.
It’s enough that good/bad posts get boosted up/down by votes without them generating Karma.
Intelligent answers aren’t always the most popular…
Reddit karma wasn’t about popularity or intelligence. It was about who got there first. If you shotgun enough comments into brand new threads your karma will skyrocket.
Also, making comments on the top comments. Plus that’s the only way for new replies to have visibility once a thread has over ~1000 replies.
Then same was true of forums and IRC
When IRC was entirely people on command line clients that existed on *nix. But that has changed with the ease of use of clients for Windows, and then eventually web clients.
Not just fewer kids. But fewer conservatives too.
Gosh, I love it here.
Conservatives love having corporate masters, so they’re all staying on reddit.
You know, it’s so funny (though obviously not in an enjoyable way per se) how those folks are so selective and picky about freedom. Like freedom is OK when it’s the freedom to enter a supermarket without a mask, but it’s not OK when it’s the freedom to express your gender. And as in this example, when it comes to corporate masters…
Don’t you just love capitalism? And don’t you just loooooove capitalists? It’s honestly frightening how reminiscent it is to the way the fascists took power in 1930s Germany.
And by the way, I’m noticing a parallel with how much they not only embrace conservative evangelical Christendom, but also act like it’s the epitome of freedom and liberty - the American Dream, if you will. If you attend one of the US’s most notorious fundie schools, you’re not allowed to stay up late, mingle with the opposite gender too much, attend dances, or be pretty much anything other than cishet (and implicitly, cishet white male). The irony of how said school is named “LIBERTY” University never seems to die on me.
Conservatives love giving lip service to freedom, but they hate anyone actually exercising their freedom.
Basically they only care about appearances and are devoid of any actual substance. That’s why they scream “virtue signaling” so much. Since they have no real virtue, they can’t conceive of anyone else having any either.
I think you need to consider the immense capability of humans for self-deceit, false logic and just think and act driven by emotion and then post-hoc using thinking to fit some explanation for it.
Also there are way more people who never learned to think in a structured way than there are people who have, plus even the former can be subtly
sawedswayed by their own wants, needs and fears (it mostly happen at the level of interpreting things with many possible interpretations and our judgment of the likelihood of various explanations where there are various possibilities, in my experience).My point being that you can’t really “read” them as thinking things through and then knowingly choosing to deceive: I think that at least the ones who just parrot that stuff do not at all internally operate like that.
Sounds like a win-win for everyone.
Impossible: everybody being happy will make the ones who like to see others miserable unhappy.
(On a more serious note, I suspect it’s related to the Paradox of Intollerance)
Truth social. Lol.
Truth Social is for conservatives that need more oppression than they get on reddit.
Moving to Truth Social is just trading one corporate master for an even bigger corporate master.
well not entirely. We seem to have a migration of r/conservative here. I looked. It is discretely awful.
Last time I looked at it, liberals were graffitiing all over it.
A lot of the political discussion I’ve read on here has also been pretty well thought out. I feel like people are taking time to explain their perspective more and even if in general it’s been more left leaning there is definitely more nuance. I was surprised by the quality of some of the discussion around the end of affirmative action.
Fewer conservatives, yes. If it wasn’t for the harcore tankies and trolls it would really be perfect. But it’s very close, much better than Reddit.
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I’m a teenage FOSS enthusiast and I’m of the opinion that there are a lot more of us here than you seem to all think.
not speaking for OP but when I think about not wanting “kids” around, I mean immature people. I’m looking to be part of something like the reddit prior to them buying Alien Blue.
Agree. I suspect that the UX challenge of the Fediverse as well as the fact that you’d largely only migrate here if you’re ideologically displeased with the admins means that people on this site skew more mature.
The people on here at the moment are the same kind of people that exclusively used old.reddit.com on desktop.
I’m gonna ruin it so fast
Booyah high five! Glad you’re here
As a fellow teenager and a FOSS enthusiast, Linux user and Linux tinkerer and hobbyist, I’m glad to see there are more people my age getting into the FOSS space.
Same same, it is mostly the matter of your FOSS knowledge, if you were a FOSS nerd you would most likely to switch from reddit in some way or another… (16 btw)
Same, also 16, and the ‘mentally kids’ excuse is more insulting than they may have realised.
I am not a teenager, but I think younger people are generally pretty fucking cool.
Yeah, yall are immature, so what, compared to old people when they were your age, y’all are so MUCH COOLER.
Seriously, on every metric, I don’t understand how you can shit on young people these days. They are just an improvement on us.
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There are dozens of us!
Much more than dozens haha
how do you do, fellow adults?
my back hurts
I have a headache
I sneezed too hard and now I have a sharp pain in my neck
I got my socks on and now I need a lie down
… Back in those days we’d tie an onion on our belt
Had to be a brown onion as the Kaiser took all our white onions
my muscles ache
We do a bit of adultery
My knees ='(
MY LEG
Pretty good today. Hope you too
Where’s the porn?
Just had my yearly colonoscopy
Lemmy is so good right now because there’s no commercialization here.
My ublock has been at a constant “0” on this site since I’ve started. A youtube tab will have over a hundred by the end of a 10 minute video.
And hopefully never will be. It seems like the people hosting instances aren’t in it for the money. Particularly the *.world guys have other fediverse projects big enough that they could’ve done something like, say, add ads to it.
The .world sites are being financed by a patreon and other donations. They even make their finances public every few months.
This is what’s so great about the Fediverse! Not only do most servers make their finances public, but a lot of them can be fiscally hosted by 501©(3) nonprofits. Which means that they can not only receive tax-deductible donations from users, but they can also apply for grants and receive donations from charity funds. Was kinda shocked the degree to which this happens setting up my small Mastodon server lol.
The reasons to develop it also are ideological and not ecological ones.
please don’t randomly start some ageism crap suddenly now please. the vibes are good because we collectively experience self-efficacy against the corporate super power that is reddit. All people should feel welcome on lemmy
I disagree. Terrible take. It’s never wise to discount, alienate, or exclude our youth. Growth is the name of the game and they’re the ones who are going to be ushering in hopefully a better future. Who will they learn from if not us? You want them stewing with each other?
No. We maintain whatever nebulous internet “culture” we like and establish rules. Anyone, young or old, who doesn’t adhere can suck eggs. That way young people learn how to act and we can hear them tell us about all the ways we need to better society.
Truly I believe that the children who develop during this time of overstimulation and rapid technological advancement will emerge maybe a bit… maladapted but better than us. Humans can be so resilient especially under supportive circumstances. Our intelligence is adaptive. So if you want to make a great internet community, maintain your respect for our kids.
For me, It’s the lack of advertising. Especially the constant guerilla advertising and flash marketing done in the larger subs.
At this point I’m just so burnt out on the constant advertisements. It’s literally shoved in your face at all times and not only does it make me actively avoid the products but its also exhausting.
Anti-advertisment, apply directly to the forehead.
foreheadeyes.
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Honestly though, if there was an anti-advertisement spray that worked I would buy it lol.
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“Hello, I’m the CEO of anti-advertisement spray. Please dm me and I’ll personally check on the status of your order!”
“Hello, I’m the ceo of Anti-Advertisement spray. After 5 long hard years in development, we’re here to talk about this stuff and shove this product down your throats. AMA!”
1.5k upvotes, people fawning over the person, stupid gold and all the stupid badges attached to the post…. FFS.
…“Barbie”, opening only in theaters July 21st.
It’s refreshing.
For me it is lack of commercial interests (ads hidden in post), lack of bots, and lack of "funny meme and jokes’ posts.
lack of "funny meme and jokes’ posts
This is it for me. The Pavlovian posting and upvoting of shitty jokes in every. single. thread. I haven’t bothered with reddit’s comment section in years because of it. Here, the comments so far seem chill and appropriate for the posts.
The Narwhal bacons at midnight, fellow hydrohomie
The same shitty jokes at that, over and over and over again.
Agreed. On top of this I noticed a pretty hard decline in Reddit once the CCP bought a portion of reddit. Keeping business out of Lemmy will keep it honest for sure.
We can always make funny memes
i’d rather have quality content though.
Don’t hold the Ads too high. If server costs for lemmy instances become too expensive, Admins might have to resort to ads and I would argue that reddits ads are way better than most intrusive web apps
I think it’s more just because we’re early adopters and the first wave of refugees.
We’re building something here - and right now, for some it’s a new home, for some of us this is something big - a place that resists monetization. This isn’t just the fresh new version of social media, built by cool people who have the best intentions and a vision (I think most of them did, at least initially)
Admins go bad, already some of the instances I’m on have people starting to look at not just paying for servers, but making a profit. And if they can live off the donations - fine, more power to them.
But when someone comes knocking with a bag of money, what are they going to do? They can sell us out, but they can’t go far before we leave… What do we miss out on? The content will either follow or we’re missing out on content elsewhere.
And we can mitigate it further - too many talented people care too much to let this idea die. We’re going to face difficult times, but it’s a new ephemeral Internet built on top of the one stolen from us - it doesn’t start or end with a reddit clone.
And I think that’s why we care - because this time is different. It can’t go bad the way everything else does. It relies on no one, and it’s built from all of us
This place is ours. No kings, no masters, no capitol, no capital
I think it’s more just because we’re early adopters and the first wave of refugees.
Yes, and because there are some little hurdles in the signup process. Having to select an instance isn’t really that big of a deal, but it will actually stop quite a few people.
The people who do make it through care or are invested enough to join and are less likely to shit the place up. It’s a self-selection process.Well put, almost made me feel inspired till I remembered we’re just nerds on the internet hahahahaha
The internet was made for nerds to be on it.
Do kids really impact the level of conversations on social platforms? Many adults are just as immature.
Yeah, sometimes on reddit I’d be talking to someone and realize oh… this person is probably 14 or something.
Its always weird to me when I realize not everyone online is ~30 years old.
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And male.
Yeah, or first year college kids who have figured out how the world should work.
And it’s not restricted to eli5
anyone that thinks random defederations are good for the users.
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Great post. Lemmy right now reminds me of Reddit 15-16 years ago. Mostly tech workers or tech hobbyists who know far more than an average person and thus aren’t put off by something new and different. I don’t think Lemmy is very complicated as a concept and it boggles my mind that people are saying “making a new account on Lemmy.world or Kbin.social is too complicated for normal people.” Yet I see it written all the time, sometimes here but mostly on reddit. And who knows; maybe the latter is a disinformation campaign since we know reddit pulls sneaky shit like that all the time (and targeting Lemmy, like with the warnings they placed on links at one point).
Lemmy’s barriers to entry also somewhat remind me of early Facebook after they expanded to several universities. You needed to have an email address from one of those univerisities in order to create an account. So, not so much self selection in that scenario but another gate to keep people out.
I can respect Tildes’ decision to become invite-only (with a very limited number of invites) for that reason. Lemmy, I think, is prioritizing growth at the potential cost of future community. Tildes is doing the opposite. I don’t think one is necessarily more correct. And, with Lemmy, there are tons of alternatives waiting in the wings. Hopefully a balance can be struck.
I think the real test comes when the first wave of good third party apps are released. Sync, in particular, seems very promising given the developer’s reddit app. Anything that can make it easier for people.
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Hey I just said I reqllly found your comment really informative and insightful, and albeit I have some vague ideas on how it is part of survivorship bias, i can’t quite tell what you refer to?
What I’m talking about is mostly negative bias so I might be wrong
Thanks for your time :)
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Thank you so much for the follow up, bridged my gap in understanding fully
I think the influence on Reddit was deeper than a lot of people have considered. The hivemind was so strong it made it difficult to have decent and useful discussion, even the puns that muddied down nearly every post’s comments achieved that end. The amount of posts I’ve seen of people feeling much more comfortable actually interacting on Lemmy, in my mind, lends weight to how Reddit wasn’t a place for objective dialogue. That’s why it felt so adolescent, like sitting at a high school lunch table.
This is like when people in 7th grade say that the 6th graders are sooo immature omg
